Monday, May 14, 2007



The best argument against Proportional Representation has been played out in Renfrewshire Council over the last week. Despite the Labour Party getting more votes than the SNP (I say this to cover the moral authority argument) the Liberal Democrats (who had less than 10% of the vote) have decided that they would sell their souls to the SNP for the chance of a disproportionate say in the running of Renfrewshire Council.

Ms McCartin is a hypocrite of the highest order ( I can say this now cause I don't have to be nice to her or stay within the boundaries set down by the Standards Commission) she suggested at previous full council meetings that PR was a fairer system of government, sorry it is not. When smaller parties (who don't even field enough candidates to win control) get to say who will be the controlling party, how is that fairer? More to the point how is this democracy? Answers on a post card but you better believe that the Liberals will have a major influence in the positions on offer, the reason? Derek is easy fodder for the likes of Eileen, she knows that he has nothing to lose and everything to gain and will milk him for all it is worth, the worst bit is that he is too scared not to let her.

Sad day for the voting public of Renfrewshire, and before anyone says this is sour grapes, it couldn't be further from my mind, with this shower in power I am kind of glad I didn't get back in I will have to spend enough of my time in four years along with the rest of the Labour group fixing their massive mistakes.


Fidothedog said...

May not be fair but thats democracy -

Rayleen Kelly said...

Fido: No it is not democracy, the people of Renfrewshire did not vote for a Liberal Democrat administration, but they got it

Fidothedog said...

Well yes it is democracy, it was an election set up following election rules:

I take it from the reply that you are not to happy with the result, but thats the democratic will and alas unless you can argue that it was in some way illegal or rigged you will have to accept the will of the people.

RightForScotland said...

No, the lib dems are not the administration. By your process the SNP are now a puppet of the four lib dems, do you honestly beleive this? I mean really?

Simple fact is that after a generation in control of the council the public decided they were not going to return you, you lost 3 seats and the right to dictate to the people of Renfrewshire.

And for the record you do sound rather bitter.

Rayleen Kelly said...

fido: I do accept the will of the people but their will was not to have a Lib Dem administration otherwise there would be more than four of them elected.

Rayleen Kelly said...

RFS: I see how my being bitter would help your cause but I am fine thanks, we have exactly the same number of representatives in the ward that I stood in as we had before the election and I for am fine with that (would have liked more but we will see how it goes in four years).

As for your assertion that the SNP will not be puppets of the Liberal Democrats, I think you should look at it again they have exactly the same number of seats as the Labour Party with less of the vote, they know that without the Liberals they lose control and believe me they will do ANYTHING for control. I realise that not really being in the cut and thrust of this you don't really get it but you will just have to take my word for it.

Allan said...

I don't Remember democracy being so bad when you guys were running the council, despite losing the popular vote 4 years ago.

Rayleen Kelly said...

ALLAN: I think you will find the point is that PR is supposed to be more representative not less!! At present it is less representative the SNP (with less votes than the Labour Party) and the Liberals (with less than 10% of the vote) now make up an administration held together by their hatred of Labour.



The facts remain.

Labour have lost control of Renfrewshire due to the vote of the people.

You got kicked out and if the info from your own party is correct - at the expense of Jim Sharkey.

Labour can no longer ride roughshod over the constituency and now other councillors can invlolve the community in decisions that are made for them. When did Labour ever do this - never!

I am pleased that you are poised to stand again in 4 years as the people of your area and other Labour areas will soon see how little you have done for them.

Rayleen - you will never get in again - so why not go and get some further education to get another job in say Burger King or KFC.

I say this as I know that they are advertising vacancies!

fraz said...

Look firstly i wonder what you would have been saying if the lib dems had picked you for the council coalition hmmm your just bitter a coalition is better, have a stable council

its time for chage and people voted for it labour have done a look for renfrewshire and done a lot of bad things you lost so accept it

labour got 17 votes and so did the snp so what has ever happened you need to stop feeling bitter and get over it

the lib dems didnt pick you thats why yiur so unhappy

Rayleen Kelly said...

RFS: I think you will find that C Lawson used be a Conservative and her husband is an ex Tory Councillor, you are out the loop!!

There were some strange voting patterns in this election and I am sure ALL of the parties will be looking at closer before the next one.

Rayleen Kelly said...

Abigail: Oh dear aren't you a bitter and twisted individual! Your venom is quite apparent, and you keep missing the main point of the argument, although this is possibly because it doesn't help you!

You say that I will never get in again, that maybe so but I am not as cocky as you I don't suppose to know the future or second guess what people will want in four years time, but knock yourself out trying if you like.

Unfortunately (for you) your argument does not stack up, and you seem to be making derogatory remarks about working for KFC or Burger King, could it be you think that these jobs are beneath you? (that is certainly your tone and if not you should certainly keep that in mind when writing again.) They are not beneath me, I am willing to work and a few of my friends work in establishments like this, it is work and it pays the bills.

And as for the further education comment I was thinking of doing a postgrad degree so thanks but I already have that covered.

Thanks for visiting though.

George Dutton said...

"And as for the further education comment I was thinking of doing a postgrad degree so thanks but I already have that covered."

Good for you Rayleen. My daughter has a BSc Hons in nursing, well worth the effort (hard slog but well worth it).

Rayleen Kelly said...

Fraz: Sorry to disappoint you but I am not bitter in the slightest. You suggest that the coalition will make the council stable, not sure where you get this from you only have to look at the Italian system to see the flaw in that argument.

Given that prior to this McCartin was going on and on and on and on that everything should be proportionate I would have reminded her of that when they had been looking at a deal.

From what I have heard (on the grapevine) this is certainly not the case with the SNP and Liberal coalition on Renfrewshire Council. From what I have been hearing (and it will all come out tomorrow I suppose) the Liberals have way more than their number of seats entitles them to, maybe that is why they went to the SNP because they knew they could push them as far as they liked given that they were so desperate.

Sorry we did not lose we got exactly the same number of SEATS (not votes) as the SNP in terms of votes we got more!!

I know this is difficult for you but try and concentrate.

RightForScotland said...


First people will be confused that you responded to my comment but did not publish my comment. You may wish to clear this up.

I enjoyed your thoughts on Lawson´s previous political affiliation but let me ask this...

Was Hogg not a former Labour councillor? and did he not only lose FPTP to you but then got humped in your Dad´s ward the other week?

fraz said...

Rayleen Kelly i do get were your comming from but if the lib dems had decided to have coalition with labour you would be saying all this it becuse your bitter you dint get your seat back and labour dint win power leas a new party can come in and sort paisleys problems out look at paisley town centre labour were told of these problems years ago ypu did nothing so i welcome a new administration

i do think your bitter there may be problems pr but i leive if the lib dems chosen you i doubt you would be saying this

i do belive you will express your views as labour party member

so it seems from this blog your just unhappy you lost

Rayleen Kelly said...

RFS: I get where you are going with this, personally I think that is more to do with Hogg than anything else he is known around the area of Shortroods but nowhere else, and he has not been a Councillor for four years so that public face is not so well known, the situation is significantly different for Celia, given that she is well known throughout the areas she now represents.

So I take your point but it is not really the same.

Rayleen Kelly said...

FRAZ: A couple of things firstly I am not bitter, upset at the time but not bitter.

As for the Town Centre, the SNP will do nothing except what the Labour Party were going to do anyway, their literature at the election showed this.

I write this blog as a member of the Labour party, a member of the catholic church, a CWU member, a cooperative member, a woman, a home owner, a mobile phone user and a non smoker amongst other things all of this influences what I write, as I am sure your affiliations influence yours.

Personally I wouldn't trust McCartin as far as I could throw her, but that is an issue for Derek now, what I would say is that had she went into coalition with the Labour Party it would have been a lot more representative than what we have at present.

And that is the point of this article (which you seem to have missed) that PR gives a disproportionate amount of power to the smaller parties without a democratic mandate to impose such policies.

It will be interesting to see if you reply to this and if you actually adrress the points, I think you are more likely to answer with your stock response 'you are just bitter' the more you use it the more it sounds as if you are.


Please note all postings on this blog are of a personal nature and do not reflect the opinions of either Renfrewshire Council, the Scottish Labour Party or Renfrewshire Labour Group. NB No annonymous comments will be published on this blog if you have something to say have the courage to identify yourself.